I am currently writing a book about the genocide of California Indians. I read bits of it to members of a collective of anthropologists and artists in London. As I write, I never cry. When I read it to the group over Zoom, I do.
After going through two bouts of major depression, my own crying doesn't really faze me any more. People can think what they think, if I'm ever in another situation where I can't just hold it until I get home. I have no idea what it would be like to cry in front of my own child. Fortunately, my two little dogs don't seem to have any trouble with it and just cuddle or lick your face.
It has been a long time since I really cried, and I'm grateful for all the days I feel OK.
The weird thing, ever since all the worst of that, is that a lot of music that I like will make my eyes well up with (happy?) tears. It feels kind of strange. The songs are good, but not _that_ good.
Ah, I'm gonna cry. I avoided reading for a few, White Woman tears took me down. What is that? I don't believe in white woman, Karen yes. Well, you covered that base and enticed ALice in Wonderland, OK opening to her. Thank you! I'll go down that rabbit hole when I can afford a run in the burrows.
Hi Susie, I understand how making yourself vulnerable around others trying to bully or exploit would be socially threatening, though I'm not sure I agree it's a class issue. I also understand the awkwardness of making yourself vulnerable in front of family. However, I think it's more developmental, and that as your grow more comfortable with who you are, you are more willing to risk your vulnerability in public. I've certainly noticed this with myself among my men friends, since men are notorious for their emotion-suppressing stoicism. Anyway, love the discussion in these times when people are finding it difficult to be real with one another, emotional or otherwise. I have to say in my experience with you, you have never had that problem.
Also, just a small nit; that is, Shiva is the Hindu male deity of consciousness, while Shakti is the feminine deity of cosmic energy, or ego destruction. Shiva-Shakti is Wholeness, or Conscious Energy or Conscious Light. Much Love, Brad
Brad, I’m so glad you popped in! You are always someone I knew could be real about grief, or hurt, on both our sides. Tell me more about the class thing, from your perspective. I mean, yes, we hear terrible tales of upper class boys in private schools, being sadistic. I get that. I think for GIRLS, it is a class issue. But I’m just feeling my way through this.
And Shiva… yes, destruction to the point of re-creation of somethign better. But I like my childhood stories my parents told me of Shiva having massive meltdowns….
Growing up I was humiliated by my mother's tears, my father almost always the cause of them, his coldness or cruelty, and it always felt like he'd won, and she'd lost, simply by crying. I was wrong and years later, getting sober, I envied the people who could cry, could access feelings I'd buried. I think the ability to cry makes healing so much quicker and less painful in that type of situation. I learned crying isn't always surrender, sometimes it's a way in when you need to find a way out.
These days I cry when the feeling comes and I'm okay with that most of the time.
I too worshipped the tough girls who didn’t cry. They were the ones who brought out my tears with their cruelty. I didn’t know what I did to deserve it so I pretended I didn’t have any feelings at all. That would fall apart over something trivial. I also didn’t know what motivated them to be so awful. I learned it wasn’t having access to any feelings when I found my own again.
Sometimes, when I watch those "Karen" videos, I feel like the white woman is a mentally ill person having a breakdown. Most of the time, they just appear to be assholes. But, still, I think there have been some obviously mentally ill people who need more compassion than our Internet culture allows.
You and I are the same age (you're a few months older), thus I get the Resting Dry Eyes thing. My tears have narrowed down to
Seeing justice done
Seeing injustice done
The loss of a very dear person or pet
Therapeutically digging deeper into my shadows
Writing an exceptionally emotional scene
My mother's tears were a weapon, nothing more, to either get what she wanted or to instill guilt in those of us who would not accede to her wishes. My father, my brother, and I all found ourselves on the business end of that.
I am currently writing a book about the genocide of California Indians. I read bits of it to members of a collective of anthropologists and artists in London. As I write, I never cry. When I read it to the group over Zoom, I do.
Reading aloud things that you could be stoic in silence, can completely spill over when you voice them aloud. So true
Now you’ve gone and made me cry…
I cry fairly easily especially over losing/potentially losing people, but have never learned or wanted to just turn on the waterworks
“Turn on the waterworks” — I love that expression. What do you observe, Kathy about English vs American tears?
After going through two bouts of major depression, my own crying doesn't really faze me any more. People can think what they think, if I'm ever in another situation where I can't just hold it until I get home. I have no idea what it would be like to cry in front of my own child. Fortunately, my two little dogs don't seem to have any trouble with it and just cuddle or lick your face.
It has been a long time since I really cried, and I'm grateful for all the days I feel OK.
The weird thing, ever since all the worst of that, is that a lot of music that I like will make my eyes well up with (happy?) tears. It feels kind of strange. The songs are good, but not _that_ good.
Puppies, the best. Such a better species than us. Infinite compassion for their companions!
Ah, I'm gonna cry. I avoided reading for a few, White Woman tears took me down. What is that? I don't believe in white woman, Karen yes. Well, you covered that base and enticed ALice in Wonderland, OK opening to her. Thank you! I'll go down that rabbit hole when I can afford a run in the burrows.
Always wanted to fall through that looking glass!
Hi Susie, I understand how making yourself vulnerable around others trying to bully or exploit would be socially threatening, though I'm not sure I agree it's a class issue. I also understand the awkwardness of making yourself vulnerable in front of family. However, I think it's more developmental, and that as your grow more comfortable with who you are, you are more willing to risk your vulnerability in public. I've certainly noticed this with myself among my men friends, since men are notorious for their emotion-suppressing stoicism. Anyway, love the discussion in these times when people are finding it difficult to be real with one another, emotional or otherwise. I have to say in my experience with you, you have never had that problem.
Also, just a small nit; that is, Shiva is the Hindu male deity of consciousness, while Shakti is the feminine deity of cosmic energy, or ego destruction. Shiva-Shakti is Wholeness, or Conscious Energy or Conscious Light. Much Love, Brad
Brad, I’m so glad you popped in! You are always someone I knew could be real about grief, or hurt, on both our sides. Tell me more about the class thing, from your perspective. I mean, yes, we hear terrible tales of upper class boys in private schools, being sadistic. I get that. I think for GIRLS, it is a class issue. But I’m just feeling my way through this.
And Shiva… yes, destruction to the point of re-creation of somethign better. But I like my childhood stories my parents told me of Shiva having massive meltdowns….
Growing up I was humiliated by my mother's tears, my father almost always the cause of them, his coldness or cruelty, and it always felt like he'd won, and she'd lost, simply by crying. I was wrong and years later, getting sober, I envied the people who could cry, could access feelings I'd buried. I think the ability to cry makes healing so much quicker and less painful in that type of situation. I learned crying isn't always surrender, sometimes it's a way in when you need to find a way out.
These days I cry when the feeling comes and I'm okay with that most of the time.
Yes, cathartic when you need them. Awful when you can’t access them!
I too worshipped the tough girls who didn’t cry. They were the ones who brought out my tears with their cruelty. I didn’t know what I did to deserve it so I pretended I didn’t have any feelings at all. That would fall apart over something trivial. I also didn’t know what motivated them to be so awful. I learned it wasn’t having access to any feelings when I found my own again.
Decades later, when I got to re-connect with some of the toughies, I realized, duh, there was a lot going on behind the scenes that I never knew.
Sometimes, when I watch those "Karen" videos, I feel like the white woman is a mentally ill person having a breakdown. Most of the time, they just appear to be assholes. But, still, I think there have been some obviously mentally ill people who need more compassion than our Internet culture allows.
You and I are the same age (you're a few months older), thus I get the Resting Dry Eyes thing. My tears have narrowed down to
Seeing justice done
Seeing injustice done
The loss of a very dear person or pet
Therapeutically digging deeper into my shadows
Writing an exceptionally emotional scene
My mother's tears were a weapon, nothing more, to either get what she wanted or to instill guilt in those of us who would not accede to her wishes. My father, my brother, and I all found ourselves on the business end of that.